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Louis Virtel and guest co-host Kyle Buchanan discuss Jurassic World Rebirth, Scarlett Johansson’s box-office record, The New York Times’ Best 100 Movies of the 21st Century list, Survivor season 50, and Jojo Siwa’s cover of Bette Davis Eyes. They also chat with Ty Burrell about his new audiobook The Good Life, Modern Family, and Salt Lake City bars.

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TRANSCRIPT

Louis Virtel And we’re back with an all new episode of Keep It. I remain Louis Virtel, the person who will continue to be on Keep It, so you better get used to me. Ira Madison, who usually is on this podcast and has only three episodes left, is still on Fire Island. I was just there myself. There is no reason for anybody to spend that much time there. So I don’t know if he’s in financial trouble or simply can’t get off the island. I have no idea, but he is there. And today we have a guest host who is not just a very talented writer and fabulous person. I have known this bastard for fucking ever. This is basically my first friend in LA, Kyle Buchanan, who is the awards columnist regarding movies for the New York Times, and also just a general movies festival gentleman, and also one of the most knowledgeable movie people I think I’ll ever meet in this lifetime.

 

Kyle Buchanan So welcome back to keep it well to be granted that compliment by you Louis means a lot But I was thinking about this the other day, too I’m like I think I’m an essential part of some Louis lore here because was I? The first or one of the first people to tell you that you should go by vertel and not fertile

 

Louis Virtel Well, I that’s an interesting question because I moved here in 2009 and I feel like I was headed that way anyway because everybody guessed it was pronounced vert-

 

Kyle Buchanan It just felt correct. Yeah. Like the sharpness of vertel as opposed to vertel. You know, you have that sharp wit to you. Thank you. And you like sharp things. You like sharp cheekbones. Yes. I feel like you often, if somebody has sharp cheek bones, you call them Andros from Star Fox. You know you like things that have a right angle and that pronunciation definitely does.

 

Louis Virtel The miniseries Sharp Objects. Maybe the only time I thought Patricia Clarkson was in A+. Maybe, yes. Pieces of April, have you seen it recently? Gotta be the cheapest movie ever nominated for an Oscar. Anyway, yeah, I met you in 2007 when I was an intern for The Advocate and you were the movie critic at The Advocat, which is the national gay lesbian magazine. Still around in some form. And then we became coworkers at Movieline.com where you had moved there from defamer at Gawker. And we got to be snarky about movies for a couple of years together. And somewhere along the way you stopped wearing scarves. Yes, well here’s what people don’t know about LA. In January at night, it is a little cold, it’s quite windy, and I just had, you know, an Urban Outfitters fuchsia scarf that I’d throw on from time to time, but people perceive that as something is mentally wrong with.

 

Kyle Buchanan This man. This was no Pashmina. This was like, I’m not saying it’s a Lenny Kravitz like Jumbo Jum Bo XXL scarf, but still a scarf. To the extent that Andrew Colon, our mutual friend, called you scarfy for a long time. That’s right. And now suffice it to say Louis wears as little as he can get away with, a mere mucus membrane suggestion of a shirt.

 

Louis Virtel Yeah, it wasn’t a Lenny Kravitz style, but it was Steven Tyler. I mean, it was pretty thick. It was pretty thicc. But you were of course in the news recently because you just co-engineered this gigantic project, the New York Times, where you ranked the 100 greatest movies of the 21st century and polled seemingly everybody. We’re gonna get into that today. The bulk of our episode today is about the 100 Greatest Movies of the Twenty-First Century, we’ll look at. What made the list, what didn’t make the list. And then Kyle and I will also get into our personal ballots for what belongs on the best of the 21st century list. But I guess my first question is how did this idea happen?

 

Kyle Buchanan And was it yours? Well, you know, the culture section had done one for books last year and that was a big enterprise, very successfully received and it just felt like the natural no-brainer to do a movies one, but still there’s a lot that goes into it. You know how when you’re trying to invite people to something, there’s always that one friend who’s like, who’s all gonna be there? That can be Hollywood sometimes. Big A-list stars and directors like the kind that we got, also wanted to know who else was taking part and part of the fun. Of putting together a list like this is seeing, well, who did people vote for? Which movies did they select? Okay, Sofia Coppola is picking In the Mood for Love, sure, but also The Incredibles. It’s fun to get those ballots in there, but you also have to coax people a little bit because they’re like, well, I didn’t vote for my friend’s movie. I don’t know if I want my ballot public. And you have to fight the urge to say, well, I’ve read your friend’s ballot and they didn’t for you either.

 

Louis Virtel Yeah, I mean, I’m sure there’s a lot to a lot of wheedling you kind of have to do to make sure they feel Safe, etc. Meanwhile, it’s like all I want is to read famously awesome filmmakers Ideas about what a good movie is like I’m desperate for that content

 

Kyle Buchanan Yes, you can sort of like triangulate somebody’s sensibility based on the movies that they voted for. And that was part of the fun of this project anyway, because there’s this feature that went mega viral where you could create your own list of the 10 best movies since 2000. And I honestly think that took off to a degree that people didn’t even realize it was part the other project. But it was fun to read every single person’s list, people that I knew, filmmakers I admired, because you do get a sense of somebody’s personality, not just the movies they like. But who are they as a person? Did you have a favorite celebrity ballot choice that really struck your fancy? Luca Guadagnino picking John Carpenter’s Ghosts of Mars. I don’t get it, and the fact that I don’t get it makes me wanna lean in. That’s the kind of thing that I love.

 

Louis Virtel Yeah, that is fabulous. Now, speaking of movies that will not make that list, Jurassic Park Rebirth? Jurassic World Rebirth. Jurassic World Reverse. I have a pretty good memory for movie titles. The Jurassic World-y-ness has totally fucked up my brain. I never get it together.

 

Kyle Buchanan And I just want to keep going back to Jurassic Park. Yeah, right.

 

Louis Virtel Do we really have to standardize world? Let’s go back to park. Like Jurassic World sounds more like a theme park than Jurassic Park. Right. Yeah. But because of its fabulous showing at the box office last weekend, now officially Scarlett Johansson, and I’m sure this includes cameos, et cetera, in the various movies in which she barely appeared superhero wise, is now the highest grossing actress of all time. How does that sit with you? Or actor of all-time?

 

Kyle Buchanan You know, I loved Scarlett Johansson back in Ghost World. Of course. And I think that movie ends… You’re gay too, right? Yes, I’m gay. Okay, you are. Okay. I think the movie ends in an interesting way because, you know, Thor Birch, it’s about these two teenage girls who are sort of alt, and Thor Birsch eventually realizes that they’re not going to be friends forever because Scarlett Johanssen is taking a more mainstream path, her character. Yes. But then also the actress, you know? She started in Indies and now she is, what, the highest, allegedly the highest cursing actress of all time. Because of Marvel, because of, you know, wearing tank tops and fighting dinosaurs and being named Zora, Zora Bennet. Sure, absolutely, if you say so. I love it for her because she is a somewhat unique star. I love when a deep voice woman succeeds. Yes. So I root for her to that degree. But I am kind of curious now that she’s got all of this, you now, time-tested box office appeal if she’s going to do things that are a little bit more outside the mainstream.

 

Louis Virtel Yeah. Well, she is, I mean, to a certain extent, trapped in the prison of these giant movies for a long time. But then I feel like she has always been good about getting back to things that are, quote unquote, interesting. You know, like, it’s not like you have to wait 10 years for her to do a Lost in Translation. We’ve ended up having Marriage Story and whatever, Lucy, or Stranger, you know, options for her. And I have to say, she’s good in all of them. I can’t really think of a movie in which I’ve found her deficient.

 

Kyle Buchanan Yeah, she’s a very good actress, especially when she’s really keyed into something as she was in Marriage Story. She’s now taking a detour into directing. I saw her directorial debut, Eleanor the Great at Cannes. Very strange movie. June Squibb is the star and it was very touching to see a woman in her 90s lead a movie and get a standing ovation. The movie I believe was referred to on social media as Dear Evan Hansen for the Holocaust. Okay. I had been begging! Where will we get this? Not necessarily the movie. You would expect ScarJo to be like, now I’m going behind the camera. But basically, yeah, it’s about, you know, June Squibb is a 90-year-old woman who moves back to be with Jessica Hecht, her daughter. I know your aunt Anna just went up. In the big city, and she’s at the end of her life, or she’s nearing it, and one of her friends just died, and you think it’s going to be about late-in-life misadventures in New York. And instead she tells a lie to many people that she was a Holocaust survivor and the movie becomes very much about that in a strange, unwieldy way. Wow. Why did Scarlett Johansson make this movie? I’m not totally sure, but as a palate cleanser after Jurassic World Rebirth, hey, whatever floats your boat, ScarJo.

 

Louis Virtel This is a completely random movie I’m bringing up. Have you ever seen the movie Music Box with Jessica Lange? No, but please say more. It’s a Joe Estherhouse movie. So this is the guy who ended up writing Basic Instinct. And before that, he did Jagged Edge, which is a very similar movie. But it’s about this Jessica Langer. Her father’s played by Armin Mueller Stahl, later nominated for Shine. Was somehow involved in the Holocaust and people are starting to come after him. They’re like, he’s committed war crimes and he claims he hasn’t. And then anyway, you’re figuring out whether or not he did it. I’m so sorry, like I have reverence for the horrors of the Holocaust but turning it into whodunit fare, I kind of love.

 

Kyle Buchanan This is definitely more Holocaust talk than you might have expected from a Jurassic World segment, but also more Holocaust Talk than I might have expected from Scarlett Johansson directorial career. That said, when it comes to Jurassic World Rebirth, my favorite thing about this movie has been the memes. I don’t know if you’ve seen, there is some sort of like mass gas lighting that is very funny happening on social media, where people are trying to convince people who have not seen this movie yet. That it is about Scarlett Johansson turning into a dinosaur.

 

Louis Virtel There’s a picture of the dinosaur with

 

Kyle Buchanan like a blonde with a blonde ponytail like her.

 

Louis Virtel A tuft of hair. Yes.

 

Kyle Buchanan Yes, these incredible mock-ups of alleged, like, screen grabs from the movie where she is becoming all scaly, but she still has that goddamn blonde ponytail. And the things I love about this beyond the obvious things are it reminds me of one of my favorite weird bits of Jurassic Park lore, which is that I think after the third original movie, John Sayles, who wrote Lone Star, wrote and directed Lone star, all these indie movies was hired to write. A gonzo fourth Jurassic Park movie about human dinosaur hybrids. Like, I just love the idea that Steven Spielberg was watching, like, Casa Delos babies and thinking to himself, I want to hire John Sayles to write a bug nuts crazy Jurassic Park movie with a character named Raptorman. That makes total sense to me.

 

Louis Virtel That is extremely wild. We’re also seeing the pictures of these dinosaurs take me back to, do you remember Dino Park Tycoon? I don’t. Is that like roller coaster Tycoon. Yes, and it predates that. And it was, you put together a little theme park and if you got enough money, there was this dinosaur you could buy who was called like Vegasaurus or something and he was like showbiz. He was like, all the other ones were like normal Triceratops or whatever then this one wore like shades. Anyway, I feel like he is like the Mac daddy of this particular meme. So look up this. This was my entire fifth grade experience.

 

Kyle Buchanan So if you don’t remember Dino Park Tycoon, it really slayed. And did the dinosaurs eventually turn on the player, as dinosaurs do, when confined to a park?

 

Louis Virtel I feel like there was some danger that they could kind of break out, but it was not horror-ish.

 

Kyle Buchanan They should have really tapped into that more. I would have enjoyed it. They didn’t like take off and eat Clippy from Microsoft Word. I have that drawn in my art one.

 

Louis Virtel Notebook if you would like to see it sometime. Anyway so we’re gonna get into the New York Times 100 greatest movies of the 21st century and also this episode our guest is the two-time Emmy-winning Ty Burrell, formerly of Modern Family, and now he has a new audible original series about his childhood that we’ll get into. And we’ll do that right when we’re back. Keep It is brought to you by Strawberry.me. We spend about a third of our waking hours working and yet so many people feel stuck in jobs they’ve outgrown or never really wanted in the first place. What if the next move is even worse? I’ve already put years into this place. Isn’t everyone kind of miserable at work? All of those feelings are real, but they’re also why so many stay stuck. That’s where today’s sponsor, Strawberry.Me, comes in. They connect you with a certified career coach who helps you go from where you are to where you actually wanna be. Whether you’re looking for a change, feeling stuck, facing a big decision, or just seeking professional growth, it’s like therapy for your career. A coach helps you cut through the noise, define your next move, and turn vague goals into a real-world plan, with the kind of accountability that keeps you moving forward. Plus, their coaches are thoroughly vetted and assessed for their qualifications and expertise and come from a wide range of backgrounds, experiences, and specializations. Don’t leave your career to chance. Take action. Own your future with a coach in your corner. Go to strawberry.me slash keep it to claim your $50 credit and get started. That’s strawberry.m e slash keepit. Stop saddling, start building the career you actually want. Last month, the New York Times asked 500 of Hollywood’s biggest filmmakers, stars, and critics to list the best films of the 21st century. Our guest host Kyle and the rest of the editorial team then whittled that list down to the 100 essential films. So today we’re going to dive into the list and share our own ballads. But first, Kyle, why don’t you tell us about how this team even handled such a sprawling project?

 

Kyle Buchanan You know, this really was an all-hands-on-deck situation for the Culture Desk, and we got so many amazing people to take part. You know we have Oscar-winning directors like Pedro Almodovar, Sylvia Coppola, Guillermo del Toro, Barry Jenkins. We’ve got Tilda Swinton, Javier Bardem, Chua Talegia for recent Keep It Guest, Daniel Dedweiler. You know? We got Sean Baker, Mikey Madison who did Enora. We have people as young as Rachel Zegler and as old as Mel Brooks. And we asked them to say, what are the 10 best movies released since January 1st, 2000? So the 10 Best Movies of the last 25 years. And you could really define that however you wanted. I actually am happy that I think a lot of people would have been tempted to just put down prestige picks, but you had Julianne Moore voting for things like Superbad and The 40 Year Old Virgin. So we have more comedies on the list than you’d expect. I think more movies that people have seen on the list than you would expect. We took those 10 from each person. And we tabulated that towards a master list of 100.

 

Louis Virtel About Julianne Moore picking those two movies and I feel like what that is is that’s the one genre of movie you wouldn’t immediately hire her for so there’s like a level of X factor to those movies for her right you know like a goofy teen comedy yes absolutely but she’s not trying out for an Appetown movie now let’s be serious right right right precisely precisely okay so on this list I’ll just start right from the top Parasite Bong Joon-ho’s best picture winning movie from 2019 is it number one then Mulholland Drive we have celebrated David Lynch here a copiously recently. Three is There Will Be Blood. Four, In the Mood for Love, which I feel like people voted for because it’s now a movie you just associate with lists. You know, like if you’re thinking of great movies, you can’t not think.

 

Kyle Buchanan Of In the Mood for Love. I was surprised because there’s a reader’s version of this and In the mood for love actually placed pretty highly on that one too so maybe maybe it has found its audience. Hopefully.

 

Louis Virtel Hopefully. Five is Moonlight. Six is No Country for Old Men. Seven is Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind. Eight, Get Out. Nine, Spirited Away. Ten, The Social Network. Elsewhere on this list, Keep It Favorite Tar is at 67 and then just a few spots below. Carol is 72. After Sun, the Paul Mescal Acting Triumph is at 78. Just before everything everywhere all at once. Let’s just talk about what charted really highly on this First of all, What were you surprised to see get, for example, maybe into the top 20?

 

Kyle Buchanan You know, honestly, I was surprised that Parasite was number one initially. I thought it might’ve been Mulholland Drive. You know that there’s a movie that you associate with best of the century list. But Parasites being number one, it kind of feels right once you start to think about it. That is a movie that feels only more relevant in the themes that it’s talking about in that class disparity and the rage that we feel. So, you know, I, I w I was very happy wants that sort of very decisively. Uh, placed at first. I wasn’t expecting, and I was really psyched because I put this on my own ballot, Ito Mama Tambien to be in the top 20. I was like, okay, we’re a little more bisexual than I thought we were. You know, I thought that might’ve been something that wouldn’t make the list at all. And to see that as Alfonso Cuaron’s highest rated film, that thrilled me.

 

Louis Virtel Mmm, Diego Luna just guest hosted Kimmel last week. Do you know who he’s dating? No, who I was sitting in the crowd during rehearsal and this woman is nearby and I’m I’m like, I absolutely I’m Mike. I’m a I absolutely know I’ve seen this woman before and she’s an actress. It took Marina de Tavira from Roma

 

Kyle Buchanan No kidding. Yes. Oh wow. How strange, right? Yes, I got to know her so well when Netflix was basically making everybody from Roma do that award season tap dance for months. Oh, it absolutely did work. I mean, she got to us better than her own family members at a certain point, but she got nominated. Yes, correct, correct.

 

Louis Virtel I think what I like about Parasite to me, that movie is the 21st century rear window, which is it is a thriller. It is a, you know, a character drama and you can enjoy it just on that surface level. If you’re literally just looking for thrills or like, will they make it out of that room or will they pull off this heist basically? But at the same time, the sociological layers of it and the psychological layers of it are so apparent so you can enjoy it as quote unquote deeply. Or as surface level as you’d like. And it’s genuinely funny. It has something for everybody. If you just want the comedy, it’s good. If you want the thrills, it is good, precisely. Yeah, absolutely. Was there anything that surprised you that it made the list? Well, I’ll just say that I don’t understand what about the Wolf of Wall Street belongs in the top 20.

 

Kyle Buchanan Sort of agree. I mean, I think the Wolf of Wall Street, which is at number 20, fun, great movie. Should it be in the top 20? It’s not where I would put it. Um, you know, it’s the highest placing Scorsese. Um. And also notable that Scorsesi got two on here and Spielberg just barely managed one minority report, which has 94. Um but yeah, I, You know, it’s a movie that I think because of, again… There are movies on this list that sort of feel more thematically relevant than ever. And at a time when we all feel fleeced by the rich, here’s a movie that’s kind of about that. At a time, when we’re all sort of dealing with the encroachment of technology on our humanity, there’s a zillion movies on that list about that, from The Social Network to Her to Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind. So I do think that sometimes when people are thinking of, well, what movies have I loved from the last 25 years? They’re also bringing in the context of the last 25 years. Yeah. What movies seem to speak to what’s been happening to us.

 

Louis Virtel You’re saying the Zone of Interest is at number 12, for example. Plenty of dystopias on here, it should be noted that Kyle wrote a book about Mad Max Fury Road. Yes, which placed number 11, I would have had it higher. Yes, interesting. Here’s what I will also say about the top 20. Not too many lady characters in the top-20 of this list. Did that-

 

Kyle Buchanan upset you in any way? Somewhat. Yeah, the female representation, obviously we talked to many, many, many women, you know, we wanted to make this as equitable a polling process as possible, but then you still get Julianne Moore voting for Superbad and the 40 year old Virgin. Bridesmaids made the list. That’s a very high placing female driven comedy. I was sort of upset that Mean Girls wasn’t there. You know, Superbad placed 100. We had a lot of other male-driven comedies. Borat is on there, for example. But Mean Girls, I mean, come on, that’s a generation-defining teen comedy. That is one of the most quotable comedies, certainly, that has come out. One of the quotable movies, period, that has came out in the last 25 years. And I was at least glad that the reader’s poll rectified that mistake. Mean Girls did make the top 100 for the readers.

 

Louis Virtel Yeah. I mean, I think what upsets me is we already talked about how Tar and Carole are far down the list. Like, I can’t name one thing about those movies that is worse than the Whirlpool of Wall Street. Like, just I don’t understand why people are voting for just a big, loud movie with great, good performances. And I can remember certain parts of it, but I just don’t think artistically it achieves anything more than those two movies, for example.

 

Kyle Buchanan And this is not to take anything away from something like there will be blood or something like no country for old men Which are great movies and which do have a sense of humor, but I wonder like would something like tar Be regarded amongst them in ten years. Do you think that’ll be in the top ten? Well, I was it just a little too fat

 

Louis Virtel Oh, that’s interesting. I mean, like, I think that movie is a beast, and also one of the few movies I’ve seen where I hate when people say this because I do not believe it means a movie is good or bad, but I couldn’t stop thinking about it and what it was trying to say, and if I was even gleaning the full message, I want to say something about there will be blood being at number three. I personally cannot imagine watching that movie and not thinking the first half is amazing and the second half is men screaming. It felt it’s just melodrama that like Builds on the melodrama and you either just say awesome at it Which I think a lot of people do and I think I lot of guys just like to say awesome it movies and move it Along but it was not Provocative to me. It didn’t bring me into the movie further I didn’t feel like I had questions about what it was going for. I did it didn’t fell interesting to me

 

Kyle Buchanan You know, I think what There Will Be Blood has and a lot of movies on this list have is a killer final scene. Yeah. And that really makes you realize that if you end well, you know, you can forgive almost anything that happens before that because that ending is what sells it. Obviously, you know plenty of people liked Enora, let’s say. Enora didn’t make the list. It’s a pretty recent movie. So it was happening during our polling period but Enora has that killer final seen. That’s the thing. I think ultimately the people were voting for when they voted that for best picture. Though it is interesting to see, there are fewer best picture winners on this list than you might think. You know, there were only about, what, a little less than a dozen, a lot of best picture winners that didn’t make that list. You know? No Birdman, no Crash, obviously. No Koda! No Kodah, no Green Book. But also, you know, know the king’s speech. All these movies that won many, many Oscars that were maybe the right movie for their moment. Our friend Hunter Pollard, he texted me and he said, you know if you take the highest placing movie from each year since 2000 from the list, only two of those would be best picture winners. Only Parasite and Moonlight will be best picture winners that were the highest placing movie of their year. So it is kind of interesting like if you’re interested in a little bit of award season revisionism to see, well, which movies have maybe stood the test of time better than the movies that actually won best picture.

 

Louis Virtel Well, it’s interesting that you bring up the ending of Enora because I feel like what probably clinched it winning best picture is compared to The Brutalist, the one thing that movie really does wrong is the ending. You know, where it’s like they wrap it up with some narration, Guy Pearce is like escaping that giant mansion and we don’t find him. And like that’s it, like three and a half hours have led up to that. I do wonder if they had nailed the landing if that would have been a more obvious.

 

Kyle Buchanan Competitor for that award another movie that has a great ending that i was excited to see on here was melancholia uh… You

 

Louis Virtel I mean, God, it’s hard to believe that Kirsten Dunst may have a definitive work, but I think after all these years, Melancholia taps deepest into the reserves of both emotion and utter callousness she can bring to a role. Is there anything that you would have liked to see on this? Let’s see, I mean, a lot of things I would have liked to have moved up. I would’ve liked something that’s gonna be on my list, on my revised list, a movie that I think has an amazing ending that not enough people talk about is the movie Two Days, One Night, which Marianne Cotillard, which if you don’t know this movie, first of all, it’s extremely short and was a completely surprising best actress nomination at the time. I think the rumor was that people got that screener first and ended up watching it. Maybe. There’s some magic to it, but anyway, it’s about a woman who’s gonna lose her job unless she can convince all of her coworkers, one at a time, to not take their holiday bonuses so that the job can pay for her. And so it’s this woman pathetically groveling and also psychologically unraveling as she’s trying to figure out how she’s gonna have money for her family, basically. But the ending of that movie is so simple. And so touching and provocative, and also real seeming. If we’re going to.

 

Kyle Buchanan Going on endings alone, that should be on the list. One movie that did not make the 100 at all, and I think a lot of people thought it might be in the top 20, as it was on the reader’s list, La La Land. I’m curious, do you think it deserved a place there? I love the-

 

Louis Virtel beginning of La La Land with the very added in freeway scene and I love the very end with the sort of tribute to old Hollywood but the I think the conflicts between those characters are just not believable at all and I don’t understand why they’re mad like when she’s like you were out of town or something and then they didn’t get to hang it’s like you both ambitious people you should be aware you’re gonna be butting up against these problems as you get somewhere in Hollywood

 

Kyle Buchanan Uh, there were only, I think about 11 films from female filmmakers. I would have liked to have seen more, but the, but some pretty cool people represented, you got Anatomy of a Fall is 26. Yeah. Did that surprise you? It’s.

 

Louis Virtel Surprised me. Well, I think in the past five years, it’s like Parasite. It’s a movie that feels arty, but also is kind of commercial, like anybody can tap into that movie. You know, so you get to congratulate yourself a little bit, I guess. But you know the only thing I hate about Anatomy of a Fall? The movie opens with for some reason on a black screen and it says, did she do It like gives away the whole ghost of the movie right at the top and also what is

 

Kyle Buchanan that like I’m supposed to go to that website? You know, I saw that movie at the Cannes Film Festival premiere. Suffice it to say that they did not have that. Yeah. I did not know that. Yeah. I said really do and they still have that up now.

 

Louis Virtel I have no idea.

 

Kyle Buchanan Idea. It felt like a prank that someone put into the movie at my screening. Like you’re watching a legit true crime Netflix show. Correct, correct. Wow, incredible.

 

Louis Virtel And by the way, it takes you two seconds into the movie to realize, oh, it’s about whether or not she did it and that we’re gonna figure it out and it’s gonna be nebulous or whatever. You don’t need didshedoit.com.

 

Kyle Buchanan To appear. Yeah, I was a little surprised that it was the highest ranking film from a female director, but maybe DidSheDoIt.com pushed that up a little bit higher. Yes, that’s right. Once you’ve committed to a website, once you’ve commited to a URL, you’ve committed to the movie.

 

Louis Virtel Precisely. Another comedy that would have been nice to appear. I’m not saying it’s like a brilliantly written comedy, but for what it produced in terms of quotability would have been nice. To see the Devil Wears Prada here.

 

Kyle Buchanan I agree. I agree, honestly, I think a lot of female driven comedies, sans bridesmaids deserved a better placement. You know, whatever you thought of Barbie, you know, the fact that of the Barbenheimer battle, Oppenheimer was the only one to make the list, it made it at 65, Barbie made way fewer ballots than I would have expected. And I really do think people just tend to underrate those movies. Or maybe they don’t ascribe that sort of cultural importance to them. You know, I remember there was a list of the best comedies of the last 30 years or something. I think it was a British list and it came out several years ago. Clueless wasn’t on there, Mean Girls wasn’t there, Devil Wears Prada wasn’t, instead Step Brothers was number three or four or five or whatever. Step Brothers, great, fun, wonderful. We thank you, Mary Steenburgen. But again, come on, it’s like there’s this whole other world, like I’m surprised that female-driven comedies still need to get their fair shake when when they truly do become lexicon-defining.

 

Louis Virtel The director with the most films on the list is Christopher Nolan, followed by the Coen Brothers, Alfonso Cuarón, Paul Thomas Anderson have four, David Fincher and Quentin Tarantino have three, then a whole bunch of other people have two. Richard Linklater, only two. Now that’s a little disappointing for me.

 

Kyle Buchanan Yeah. Well, I hope that David Fincher might take a look at this list and be like, do I really need to do the US remake of Squid Game? Maybe I can get my mojo back and make great movies again. But it is interesting. I mean, there’s obviously no denying that Christopher Nolan is sort of the Spielberg of this era. Alfonso Cuarón, you know, thrilled to see he had so many movies. That’s another person where I’m like, come on, get your mojo pack, get out there. I think that especially right now when it’s so hard to get any movie made, especially one that has a unique vision, God, there’s almost a responsibility for some of these people to make a few more, you know, big screen entries. That’s why even though, look, I’ll watch Greta Gerwig’s Narnia film for Netflix, I’m kind of like, come on, Greta, Strike While the Iron is Hot. You know, you’re one of the few female filmmakers on this list at all, certainly the one with the most like big studio cache. Take advantage of it.

 

Louis Virtel Right, right, right. But speaking of directors I thought would be better represented here, Peter Jackson only has one Lord of the Rings film here. Based on how, shall we say, male the list runs, I would have thought you’d have gotten all three of those movies, since they are certainly probably the most rewatched movies of the past 25 years.

 

Kyle Buchanan And you definitely do on the readers list you get all three. I do think that sometimes people when they’re you know, when they At least the people that we pulled from Hollywood, you know If you only get ten movies how many films for our favorite trilogy are you going to put down? How many sequels at all? I think the first Lord of the Rings was sort of meant to stand in for the Well, maybe not the Hobbit movies, but you know the rest of them so it does become an interesting thing. You’ve also got Black Panther there, you have the first Ocean’s Eleven. You know, there are some films that did go on to spawn a franchise. Although, it is interesting to see that the only Pixar films that made the list, you know, Up, Ratatouille, WALL-E, are the films that didn’t spawn sequels. In fact, to the extent that I think that Inside Out might have made that list, if we hadn’t just recently gotten an Inside Out 2.

 

Louis Virtel Right. The highest animated movie on this list, by the way, is Spirited Away, which I think surprises nobody. But I was blown away that Toy Story 3 wasn’t on this list, though.

 

Kyle Buchanan Again, I think it’s that sequel thing. People aren’t really picking out that second, third, or in the case of Toy Story, this is a movie that, or this is film franchise that’s about to have its fifth movie come out. I think that kind of does undercut these films somewhat in people’s minds, or at least in the minds of voters when they’re saying, well, what is the movie that I would sort of take to my grave? Because this is hard assignment. People think, oh, it will be easy. I know what movies I put on my 10. But, you know, you start getting to the point where you can’t believe you would leave that movie out. Or maybe you’re eliminating this movie because this other movie you put is a little bit similar. So, you now, are you going to put Toy Story 3 or are you gonna put something like Wall-E?

 

Louis Virtel Do people just resent the scene where we had to think about toys going into an incinerator, like melted Woody face during that whole, I mean, like I remember that’s the only animated scene I’ve ever seen in a movie where I actually may have even said out loud, this is fucked up.

 

Kyle Buchanan But I think that really works, honestly. I mean, I think the movie’s great, yeah. I was thinking about it the other day, back in the day when Walt Disney was making live action movies, you would get things like Pollyanna or Old Yeller, and they all had incredibly fucked up endings where terrible things would happen to the protagonist. They’d have to shoot their dog or they’d become, they’d fall out a window or something like that. And I think these days a lot of family movies are hesitant to engage with that. And of course. Nobody does ultimately get incinerated, though that would be baller. But the fact that they’re making peace with their imminent death is, yes, definitely not a thing that you would expect to see in a Toy Story movie. And honestly, one of the most memorable scenes in an animated movie, certainly that we’ve gotten in the last 25 years.

 

Louis Virtel Right. I am still not over in WALL-E the dystopian picture of everybody being fat. That is so crazy. Who made that choice? But also Robots Loving Purpose Streisand. Yes, no. Oh, yes. Hello, Dolly. So who balances that? Is it the Streisands? Is it just the Louis Armstrong recording of Hello Dolly?

 

Kyle Buchanan No, he watches the actual film, which I was just watching numbers from Hello Dolly, Egg Quads, and Palm Springs over the weekend.

 

Louis Virtel If you haven’t been to Palm Springs, you must go to Quad’s Broadway Bar where they are constantly update this rotation But they’re playing old scenes from musicals generally. Occasionally they’ll play like something from like South Park Bigger Longer and Uncut But for the most part you’re going to see Hello Dolly and things like that. Yes

 

Kyle Buchanan Yes, or the condoms rose condoms scene from Golden Girls.

 

Louis Virtel Yes. Oh, yes.

 

Kyle Buchanan Which did not make the list. It wouldn’t have been eligible in any way, shape, or form,

 

Louis Virtel Still. Exceptions can be made if you know the right people. Okay, that’s our take on the official New York Times list, but when we’re back, we’ll reveal our own top 10 picks. And before that, some quick housekeeping. Summer Reading Alert, Amanda Littman’s new book, When We’re In Charge, is out now from Crooked Reads. It’s a guidebook to leadership for the next generation from the founder of Run For Something and the newest release from Crookeds Publishing Imprint. When We’re In Charge makes a great gift for new grads, friends celebrating a big promotion, or anyone looking to up their beach reading game this summer. Plus you can complete your book look with a We Do Not Dream of Labor tote, perfect for anyone who wishes every day was a summer Friday. Just head to crooked.com slash store for the exclusive tote bundle, or head straight to crooked dot com slash books to get the book. All right, when we’re back, Kyle and I share our favorite films of the 21st century. And if you disagree, you’re weird. Keep It is brought to you by Helix. If you have paid attention to me for even one second on this damn podcast, you know I am a Helix super fan. I’ve had the mattress forever. I actually changed mattresses. I was like, let me try a different Helix mattress. And this one was even better than the other one. So I can’t say that they have one even deficient mattress. I sleep extremely well. I slept 10 hours last night and I’m recovering deeply from my time in Fire Island. So if I didn’t sleep for 10 hours, I might just crack in half. And I thank Helix for getting me up right. Helix knows there’s no better way to test out a new mattress than by sleeping on it in your own home. That’s why they offer a 100 night trial and a 10 to 15 year warranty to try out your new Helix mattress. Everybody is unique and everybody sleeps differently. That’s what Helix has several different mattress models to choose from, each designed for specific sleep positions and field preferences. So how will you know which Helix Mattress works best for you and your body? Take the Helix sleep quiz and find your perfect mattress in under two minutes. As you know, I took the Helix Sleep quiz, I am still in midnight luxe, which feels like a sexual read on me, but it is just one of the mattresses they offer, and I think probably still the best one. The best part? Your personalized mattress is shipped straight to your door free of charge. Go to helixsleep.com slash keep it for 27% off site-wide exclusive for listeners of Keep It. That’s helix sleep dot com slash keepit for 27 percent off site wide exclusive for listeners of Keepit. Make sure. You enter our show name after checkout so they know we sent you, helixsleep.com slash keep it. We’re back and it’s the time we’ve all been waiting for. So Kyle, what are your top 10 films of the century? And keep in mind, I’ll be angry at the drop of a hat.

 

Kyle Buchanan And I hope to inflame you, you know, so I was actually one of the very first people who cast my ballot. So I was very curious to see how many of these movies are going to make the top 100. Like I said, one of them totally surprised me, E to Mama to NBN. I also voted for Mad Max Fury Road Shocker, Mulholland Drive, Lost in Translation, Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon. We’re staying on the rails so far. I had 12 years of slave.

 

Louis Virtel And call me by your name. I just want to say that by the way 12 years a slave is almost underrated now in retrospect Like we at the time it was like oh, this is a very serious movie It’s a very violent movie with a bunch of good performances in it But I want to stay it’s one of the best best pictures of the past 25 years for sure

 

Kyle Buchanan I wholeheartedly agree, I think that it’s rated a little bit lower than it might normally be because it’s not the movie that you would leap to re-watch, you know? It’s a harrowing experience, but it’s a foundational movie and you’re absolutely correct, one of our best best picture winners.

 

Louis Virtel Also, I don’t know if you saw Sarah Paulson in Appropriate recently, a couple of years ago. She was in the play for which she won a Tony. But in that play, she established herself as just Laurie Metcalf. Like she’s just simply Laurie Metcaf now. And that movie is what Laurie Metcap is for Scream 2, is what that is for Sarah Paulsen. She, in that movie, is so fucking scary. And scarier than she ever was in any of the American horror stories, not that I watched them. But it reminds you that she has a certain power that we have sort of lost to her kind of quirkier roles recently.

 

Kyle Buchanan Louis I want to thank you because I think you articulated something that we all felt as a culture But we’re too reluctant to say which is we were all thinking about Lori Metcalf and scream to.

 

Louis Virtel I only have so many references, yes, that’s what, okay.

 

Kyle Buchanan So I had those seven that made the list and I had three other picks that did not make the list, which are devastating. Two of them are movies that feature one of my favorite things, which is an Oscar-winning actress reacting emotionally to opera. Sure, Birth? Yes, I know if you’re into acronyms. Birth with Nicole Kidman reacting emotionally to opera and Margaret with Anna Paquin reacting emotionally opera. Two very underrated films. I would have thought that Birth would make this list, because I feel like it’s got one of the best single takes of all time. The camera is just focused on Nicole Kidman as she goes through the gamut of absolutely everything in her actress arsenal. Margaret, if you have not seen, please do. Very underrated movie that was caught up in all sorts of behind-the-scenes infighting. Anna Paquin, Matt Damon, Mark Ruffalo, all sorts of incredible people. It’s written and directed by Kenneth Lonergan, who did Manchester by the Sea. It is one of my favorite movies. It is so funny. Watch the theatrical version, though not the extended.

 

Louis Virtel That’s I think another thing that kind of scared people off is at the time it was known for being a very long movie and also very polarizing like you might totally reject this movie wholesale and then if you’re, you know, an infidel.

 

Kyle Buchanan But it’s very funny too, and I think anybody with have a brain, which is everybody listening to this podcast would love it. My 10th movie, also devastating that it didn’t make the list, but it continues to be very underrated, is 20th Century Women. Starring Annette Banning, she does not react emotionally to opera in it, but if that happened in a deleted scene, I wouldn’t be shocked. It is a great, wonderful, humanist movie directed by Mike Mills. Who also was one of the voters for our project. He put One of Them Days as one of his 10 favorite movies since 2000, which I loved that pick.

 

Louis Virtel First of all, I just want to say about that movie, SZA and that movie is one of the great musician turned actor performances. To say she holds her own is like completely underrating her. She is fabulous in that movie. I also put 20th Century Women on my list. If you haven’t seen this movie, it was in the famous Oscar year where people mostly talk about how Amy Adams didn’t get the nomination for Arrival, but Annette Bening also didn’t a nomination for this movie. And it’s something.

 

Kyle Buchanan And it’s something she should have won for.

 

Louis Virtel Yeah, first of all just a period in time. I love this is around it takes place around what like 1980 or something I’m gonna say I thought the period of time that you loved would just be Annette Benning and overalls. That’s Which is just eras. Yes, right But that is the only screener I have ever watched and I was with my friends Gus and Mason while we watched it that we clapped at the screener afterwards Truly brain rot behavior, but um his movie before that was beginners with Christopher Plummer And he of course won the Oscar for yes, and you would have

 

Kyle Buchanan thought that mojo would extend to a net but uh overlooked what do you think of his movie come on come on with walking in phoenix didn’t love it quite as much but i always ride and die for mike mills and i fucking love gabby hoffman

 

Louis Virtel in that movie. Yes, well, Gabby Hoffman in any movie put her in more. Yes, right. Okay, my list. Parasite is also on mine. Okay. Also, you know what must be said about a movie that’s arty, this arty and also funny and also an adventure and has so much in it? So rewatchable. Like when I watched it, I was like, oh, I want to show this to people and then see their reactions while I watched that. And I can’t say, have that feeling about many of the movies on the list this way. If Parasites was on at a bar.

 

Kyle Buchanan Everyone eventually would just be watching Parasite.

 

Louis Virtel Yes, there we are. The Zone of Interest, which Jonathan Glazer, also who did Birth, I just thought that was one of the… That movie year, which was 2023, I was waiting for something to really, really hit. And that was, to me, a movie with a concise, strong statement and yet also a layer of very dark humor regarding like, wow, these people are really wrapped up in some unimportant the Holocaust occurs next door to them. It’s just like, it’s almost like a far side comic or something.

 

Kyle Buchanan Yeah, I don’t know if you had this feeling while watching it, but I was often reminded of Jada Pinkett Smith in Scream 2. Yeah. Yes, as in, getting murdered, oh, well.

 

Louis Virtel People aren’t paying attention, yes.

 

Kyle Buchanan Well, or I was just, it was a Lori Metcalf.

 

Louis Virtel Okay, oh, well, we can keep… I could do this all day, bitch. I love that you took it seriously. And by the way, what movie theater is that shot in? The Vesta in LA. Yes, yes, yes. OK. The Rider. Chloe Zhao. That’s a good pick. That is a good pic. And by the way, I stan Nomad.

 

Kyle Buchanan Then too, and I won’t stand for people who don’t like Nomadland. NomadLand did not make the 100, which is interesting because Chloe Jau is, you know, one of our top-tier female directors right now. But The Rider is her best movie. That is taste, Louis, that is taste.

 

Louis Virtel Thank you, yeah, it’s about a rodeo star who eventually suffers an injury and what occurs in his life. It’s just so, I feel like you’re watching life actually occur. I don’t know what else to say about it. It’s like they really, there’s a tenderness to all the performances and as Khloe Zha was apt to do, there are lots of non-actors in it.

 

Kyle Buchanan Yes, and when a handsome man suffers but doesn’t know how to express that emotionally, I’m riveted.

 

Louis Virtel Oh, shall we talk about ordinary people for the 90th time on the show? Uh, uh, Drive My Car, which is one of the fabulous, uh… I mean, it’s a very epic movie, but there’s a lot… Every performance is fabulous, we’ve talked a lot about that. Forty-five Years is one my favorite movie starring Charlotte Rampling. It’s about a woman who is in this marriage for forty-five years. Here’s a bit of information about her husband pertaining to right before their marriage, and it just unseats everything she thought she knew about her own life. And Charlotte Rampling has one of these, the face that’s coming to mind is Lauren Bacall-like faces where every feature is so big so that even like the slightest soup son of sadness registers in like jumbotron ways. And watching just her face react to the smallest things in this movie that are seismic behind the eyes, so specifically fabulous.

 

Kyle Buchanan If 45 years had not been on your ballot, I would have done a wellness check. Where’s the Louis I know? Louis and I know that if he’s ever taken hostage and he’s on a phone call and I say, what are your 10 favorite movies since 2000, if he does not mention 45 years, I know to send the police.

 

Louis Virtel Right. And a an alien has taken over my body, right. You know what I put on this list, Maria Full of Grace with Catalina Sandina Moreno from 2004 about a woman who decides to traffic drugs over the border by swallowing them. So I just want to say as somebody who doesn’t like swallow pills period, it is extremely traumatic. So maybe that’s what registered with me, 20th century women. The one I might switch out for two years one night is Everybody Wants Some is on my list.

 

Kyle Buchanan That’s a great pick.

 

Louis Virtel Yeah. Alright, I-

 

Kyle Buchanan Yeah, all right. I didn’t know you were such a stan

 

Louis Virtel Yeah, okay, if you’ve not seen this movie, I think I talked about it in the past couple of weeks, it’s about a bunch of guys at like a college where they play baseball, and it’s just about the three days before the semester begins, so they have nothing to do but party. And I think it’s the rare slice of life movie that is also a total blast. Like you’re never like sit like, I feel like slice of like movies tend to be like. You know, you learn something about the human condition, but ultimately it’s about how life’s a little boring. And this is not boring at all. And you love how like stupid and horny and frustrated and like juvenile they are. It really puts you in an ego system.

 

Kyle Buchanan Yeah, Richard Linklater, one of our premier filmmakers where you come out of the movie being like, maybe I do like straight men. Yeah. Are they cool? Maybe they should run the country? Yeah. Wait.

 

Louis Virtel Oh yeah and in this movie it seems like they all have really great taste in music because it’s 1981 and they’re all listening to fun stuff. Phantom Thread is on my

 

Kyle Buchanan My list. Great movie, absolutely. And I do think Phantom Thread is one of those movies that is just going to rise in estimation like the further we get from it. There will be blood being in top five that feels like an unshakable pick these days, but Phantom Thred for my money, that’s what I’d rather see as the highest place in Thomas Anderson.

 

Louis Virtel And it’s like 25 on this list, so it’s not like it totally fell off or anything. But I just, first of all, it’s one of the great gay coded straight performances from Daniel Day-Louis, who is a fashion designer named Reynolds Woodcock. And he’s just prissy in a way that straight men aren’t anymore. He feels like a classic fashion designer in that way. But when his wife, who’s like learning how to adjust her temperament and attitudes to appease him, who is this like very kind of introverted creator type, he says at one point, I can’t begin my day with a confrontation. And just they can only be described as continuous what he does with the role. And as you know, Dinda Day-Louis once upon a time would play roles like my beautiful laundrette, we could expect queerness from him. So it felt like such a return to a universe I’d never see him go back to in this movie.

 

Kyle Buchanan Yes, and kind of vertigo-coded. Like, I wish Kim Novak could have just, you know, taken some cues from Phantom Threat and poisoned Jimmy Stewart in the third act of that movie.

 

Louis Virtel And then that would teach him to love her more and need her, yes. And of course the fabulous Leslie Manville is in this too. And then of course I also picked Carol, which I think, speaking of rewatchable. People are like, I consider Carol a Christmas movie. I can’t imagine watching it at any other time. It’s like one of the great Christmas movies. So you wait till Christmas to watch Carol? Certainly, certainly. Because like- Do you Carol while watching Carol? I don’t have that bravery. I don’t even like to pretend to sing, I can. But I think something else you and I have in common is standing Rooney Mera, who I find to be underrated in that it’s like, I think people want… From actresses generally speaking, only vulnerability, or they want only comedy, and she is not gonna give you all the hints to what’s going on with her character. So I feel like she’s closer to what I expect from people in real life.

 

Kyle Buchanan Well, something else we have in common and you recently expressed this on Keep It is standing Kate Mara. Yes. Who is also a great actress and she was fantastic in Brokeback Mountain, has been great ever since and I think deserves some of the opportunities that Rooney is getting. But I do love Rooney Mara, like somehow after Dancer in the Dark, the actress spirit of Bjork got reincarnated in a rich football player, football team, Eris, and we’ve got Rooney.

 

Louis Virtel Yes. Whatever she’s doing with Kate, by the way, they’re in some movie where they’re in like a still together.

 

Kyle Buchanan I think it’s in a Herzog film.

 

Louis Virtel Yeah. Okay. I am so scared and ready.

 

Kyle Buchanan Exactly that. Exactly those emotions.

 

Louis Virtel And by the we talked about this last because it was the 20th anniversary of Brokeback Mountain, but I would also consider putting that on my list. I don’t think there’s a wrong note in that movie and we treated it at the time like, oh, it’s a little over long or it’s just stretched out short story, but I personally think every note of it was well done including the ending, which is fabulous.

 

Kyle Buchanan Well, I love that you said every note because I went and watched the re-release, too, and then as soon as I heard the first note of the score, I was bawling. Yes, you are right in it. It was like a Babylonian response.

 

Louis Virtel Yes, right. Oh, that music is so specific. And also the jukebox choices are so specific, like a love that’ll never grow old by…

 

Kyle Buchanan Amy Lou Harris and yeah, lovely. Great soundtrack, great Anne Hathaway lipstick on the teeth performance.

 

Louis Virtel Yes, and also.

 

Kyle Buchanan Anne Hathaway on the phone, my darling. I mean, Anne Hatherway in those wigs. Right. What was so interesting about re-watching it is that, you know, so many of these people are playing much older than they were at the time, except unfortunately, sadly Heath Ledger. For the rest of them, we can sort of compare that against the people that they became. And Anne Hathaway was nailing that sort of like later in life, grand dame feel that that character would have. And that to some extent, Miss Hathway possesses.

 

Louis Virtel Jake Gyllenhaal still only won Oscar nomination and it’s Brokeback Mountain, how do you feel about that? Well, he’s not going to get it for doing Guy Ritchie movies.

 

Kyle Buchanan Yeah, it’s so upsetting. I don’t know what’s happening there.

 

Louis Virtel Have you seen the movie The Man from Uncle recently? Yes, I have. That was one of the better ones. Wait, are you going to go in? It’s a very entertaining movie and looks amazing. The performances are such trash. And I’m talking about Alicia, I’m talking about Army Hammer, Henry Cavill. So you like everything about it except any of the people. Can we get another take on that stiff ass fucking line reading? But again, it’s like a gorgeous Lincoln commercial or something. Like I’m not really in it for the performances.

 

Kyle Buchanan Yeah, but it is baffling. I don’t know what’s happening with Jake Gyllenhaal’s career. I guess he just decided he needed to make money at some point. But you know, just like, though I liked him in Michael Bay’s ambulance, I don t quite know where he’s heading.

 

Louis Virtel Yeah, and when he takes too broad of character roles in like Okja or Velvet Buzzsaw, I’m like, that’s not right either.

 

Kyle Buchanan Look, God bless the big swings. But can we get back to that sort of like brokeback era, Jake, that was just making immaculate choices at all times.

 

Louis Virtel I think maybe we praised him too much for Nightcrawler and he’s like, but I can do other crazy things too. And I’m like, what if you did other sane things? Okay, but you know what, Nightcrowler, Nightclawler, I should put that on my back.

 

Kyle Buchanan I should have put that on my ballot.

 

Louis Virtel Well, also Riz Ahmed who is like down low the hottest person. Yes. We treat him like he’s just a good actor. Wrong, he should be objectified.

 

Kyle Buchanan Does one of the best American accents, better American accents than actual Americans. Right, yeah. Does a better American accent than January Jones, and she is American. Well, let me say, we call that Tony Colletting, when you can successfully. You can successfully hide.

 

Louis Virtel Or maybe you should say Sarah Snooking. She really is the queen of that right now. Yeah, he snucked. He snuck real hard. So anyway, those are our choices. Feel free to disagree with us. Actually, I would prefer if you did, because if you agree, there’s nothing to say. When we’re back, the fabulous and Emmy-winning Ty Burrell.

 

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Louis Virtel This week’s guest is arguably the best TV dad of the century. Take that Neil Flynn on the middle. He’s a two time Emmy winner for his role as Phil Dunphy in Modern Family. And now he’s putting his golden voice to use as the narrator of his new audio book, The Good Life. Please welcome to keep it Ty Burrell.

 

Ty Burrell Hi.

 

Louis Virtel So psyched to have you. I mean, like I was just at Fire Island and with a bunch of friends and we replayed Modern Family, which I think might be the most replayable show on the planet. Like you just put it on and suddenly nine episodes have slipped past.

 

Ty Burrell I don’t know if my kids would agree, but I’m happy to hear that. It’s kind of crazy, you know, the very, very young people that seem to be discovering it now after all these years. But it’s always kind of comforting to know that it, to some degree, holds up. And I always try to relay that to the writers because they never hear that enough.

 

Louis Virtel It is actually sort of a relief these days that certain things from the past just randomly bubble up and people kind of have no idea that they were even old. Like, Dreams by Fleetwood Mac is about to hit the Spotify top 10 again. It’s like, we already had the resurgence. How can it possibly resurge, you know?

 

Ty Burrell There was the, the moment like five, six years ago, right? With a guy being

 

Louis Virtel On the skateboard. Yes, right. And that wasn’t enough. That wasn’t. We’re still dreaming. Yeah. Thunder’s still only happening when it’s raining. So this Audible original, it’s a story, acted out sitcom basically, but it’s about your childhood. And I was thinking, this seems like it would be less work than filming a sitcom because there’s no visual element, but at the same time, because of the way audio was recorded. You can do every single line within a single sequence of dialog millions of times to get it right you might do animation so which is actually more tax

 

Ty Burrell Uh, I think this is, this is easier. I love it because, you know, I basically don’t have to leave my home and I’m very much a homebody. Um, but it’s, it’s kind of all the good stuff and what, you know, without necessarily having to like travel, like it’s very creative. Um, you know, just, uh, Katie Rich was our director and She’s just a blast. So to your point, like you can end up doing bunches and bunches of takes, but it’s all really fun. It’s all kind of like seeing what works and what doesn’t. And it is the same, you’re right, it is same processes of making a sitcom, essentially. It’s just that the execution of it, I don’t have to wear pants. I see a victory for you.

 

Kyle Buchanan Ty, what was it about the way that you grew up that made you think there’s a show here?

 

Ty Burrell Uh, it was very much this, this store that we bought, um, my, my dad and his brother bought this truly remarkable little store out in, in a town of 200 people in a city or city, a province called Applegate, Oregon, and the store had, uh, It was the entire town. It was it was the grocery store. It was the gas station. It was a cafe. It was the post office. It was the library. It was the fire department. There was a fire truck there. It was a hardware store. It was sort of like all of these things that you could you could kind of like manufacture to make a sitcom and you would actually because you kind of want all your locations in one spot, but it just happened to be though. The way that we grew up and most, not most, but many of the stories that are in The Good Life in the Audible series are taken from our childhood. And it was, you know, like you hear a lot of people in my generation say we were, you were completely feral kids. And, you It’s a Yeah, it was very fun to revisit it. My brother and I had been tinkering around with this idea for a long time, feeling like it should be a show. But this format really ended up being kind of perfect for it.

 

Louis Virtel What went into the casting for this? Because you have people like Jennifer Garner plays your mom. You’ve got Colton Dunn on this show, Jillian Bell, Egor Wadoms on this Show. What was it like casting alleged or I guess real figures from your life? Was it important for you that they actually resembled the people they once were? Were you like, well, let’s take creative license.

 

Ty Burrell Yeah, we kind of went away from, in reality it was two families. We really, especially once Jen was on board, I think, you know, we really want to lean into the mom character. My mom was an educator, and really in some ways is the person who kept was sort of the glue of that whole thing, kept the store going. Uh, this became more, I mean, in some ways, you know, it was like, well, we can’t really try to replicate our family because also they’ll be so pissed. You know, basically making jokes at their expense. But also Jeremy Hall is a great writer and wrote this. It kind of helps to have him have his own version of it, if that makes sense. So it’s not just me saying like, well, that isn’t how it was or that isn’t how that person was. A lot of it I think benefits from him being able to, you know kind of envision his own characters.

 

Kyle Buchanan Ty, there is that fun sitcom rhythm to this show, though. I know you said that this audio format works really well, but if a network wanted to pick it up, Maybe wanted to cast you as your dad, would you be interested?

 

Ty Burrell Yeah, I mean, Audible is definitely, you know, doing more of this in terms of making these into TV shows. And I think I’m too old to play my dad. But I’d love to narrate it, you know, on television as well. I think you’re right. I mean it’s a sitcom. It’s a sit-com on Audible. And I can’t praise Jen Garner enough. I really wish she would do one. I wish she was do a sitcom because she’s so good in this and she’s such a kind of natural for this type of rhythm like you just said. But yeah, I mean, I think, you know, we’re so happy to have made it. And if there were more of these on Audible, then great. And if it becomes a TV show, then that would be great too.

 

Louis Virtel Thinking back to the synergy you had with Julie Bowen on Modern Family, mysteriously one time I had the pleasure of being on set of that show because I write for Jimmy Kimmel Live. And we did a thing at the end of that show we did little bit where Jimmy was the fake documentarian who was interviewing all the characters on Modern family. And so I got to see you and Julie basically glance at the script. Put it down, shove it behind the pillows you were sitting near, and then do five versions in a row of this script that were all totally different. I mean, it was crazy to see and it was just obviously how you operate. And I was wondering if one, if you just missed the synergy you have or had with her, and then two, how much of a pleasure that is, or how hard is that?

 

Ty Burrell I’ll tell you, that’s so astute, like, it’s the thing that I miss the most. Like I’ve taken a long break and I, and I it’s been great. Like I have no, no regrets, but I have gotten the itch again recently a little bit, and it’s that, that the thing I actually miss, I miss the, the in between the shots, the kind of like between each other. Julie was an incredible partner. Um, and you, you know, you remember from being, or the writers, we all come out and kind of put our heads together, go do another take. It’s different. The takes always different that to me is like the purest form of, of what makes, makes it just so joyful. And I do miss that. I genuinely miss that that is, I don’t miss a lot of the other stuff, but that moment that you just described, uh, I really do miss. And I miss doing it with Julie. And I would say, like, you came in after 200 and whatever episodes, right? It was kind of crazy towards the end how much of that process gets in your bones, to the point at which there are little packets of our script sides stuffed all over set, because you would kind of like, I hope it wasn’t like, Laziness, I think in some ways it just kind of like got into your bones about put together a few takes quickly. But you captured a moment, so.

 

Louis Virtel There would be scripts hanging out of, like, SeaQuest. It was like Emily Dickinson in poems all over her estate.

 

Ty Burrell Yeah, that’s super fun. That is a super fun…

 

Kyle Buchanan Ty, what went into that break? I remember reading an interview with you not long after Modern Family ended where you said you were still debating whether you wanted to perform or not. So take us into both sides of that debate.

 

Ty Burrell Well, I’ve always I love I love the creative part of what we do. I I grew up in a home where my dad was always at home. He was a family therapist. So that’s a little bit like the Good Life, the podcast. But my dad was always home and and, you know, he wanted to be home. Or at least it appeared he wanted it to be at home and. I love being at home. I love around my family and it’s just, it’s not altruistic. It’s genuinely like selfish. I just like, I like being at home and there’s no way, I live in Utah. There’s really no way to work and not be gone. Except for stuff like this, which is fantastic. So that’s a big part of it. It really is a big part of that I felt like I kind of just been so lucky with my career. I really just got so lucky to kind of check off a lot of the boxes in theater and film that I kind of hoped to be a part of. So yeah, that’s kind of like the nutshell of why I’ve taken the break, but I will say like I have recently and some of it is doing this podcast. I have kind of gotten the itch a little bit. Kids are ready for me to go. They’re teenagers. The level of eye rolls right now tells me that it wouldn’t be the worst thing if I go work during the week and fly home. But yeah, that’s kind of where my headspace has been.

 

Kyle Buchanan And you’re starting to miss those 5 a.m. Call times.

 

Ty Burrell That I don’t miss, but yeah, the putting your heads together with really funny people and that part I am kind of missing.

 

Louis Virtel You also have a bunch of scattered, strange film roles that continue to fascinate me. Foremost among them, looking in my eyes and sensing the gayness in my voice. Do you know what movie I’m about to bring up? Fur? Yes! Wow. Wow. You’re an ally, Ty. Where you played the husband of Deon Arbus, played by Nicole Kidman in one of her strangest posts. Yes, yes. Well-pronounced. Thank you, thank you. Kyle said beforehand he wanted to be the first to pronounce it correctly and I beat him, so sorry. But that is among, first of all I just want to say about Nicole Kidman, after she won this Oscar she did a bunch of strange movies and this was one of them, but I really can’t compare that movie to any other and I was wondering what your experience on that movie was like.

 

Ty Burrell It was incredible. It was such a big break for me. I mean, I was doing almost exclusively theater at that point. I’d done a couple of guest roles on Law and Order, which was a thing in New York back then. It was like going to the DMV, it was doing a Law and order. And Steve Schoenberg literally took a massive risk on me just from auditioning, you know? And I’d loved Secretary. I thought that movie was just incredible.

 

Louis Virtel Oh, which was written by Aaron Cressida-Wilson who wrote this, yes, right.

 

Ty Burrell And so I just was like, you know, I was thrilled. I mean, I would have taken, if I were being honest, I would’ve taken any job. It wasn’t like I was at a place where I was like do I want to take this risk on this kind of odd film? It was like no, it’s this movie with Nicole Kidman and Robert Downey Jr. I also though was an Arbus fan. You know, was living in New York and her street. Presence I just mean in terms of like you saw her photographs all over, you know Like it just felt like I saw that you know, there would be obviously exhibits But they just kind of they’re sort of ubiquitous in New York and they she was just so brilliant. So I did have that Yeah, so I was just thrilled. I went in, like I had no reservations at all. Just like, I was so excited to be there. She could not have been more lovely. So she really took care of me. I think she knew how nervous I was. She was a great leader, great leader. Like what you’re looking for in a call sheet, you know, for number one, is a level-headed. Kind person, and she absolutely is all of that, like just a wonderful, wonderful leader. And that set was a little bit, got to be chaotic because there was, there became issues, I mean it’s far enough away now that I can, you know, say this stuff, but there became issues between the financing, the producer, and the director. And she had to kind of… Come in, mitigate, facilitate, and she was brilliant at it. So I have great memories of that movie. The movie, I don’t know, I haven’t seen it in so long, but yeah, it was an incredible experience.

 

Kyle Buchanan I’m surprised there’d be any financial issues for such a straight down-the-middle mainstream pitch like Fer.

 

Ty Burrell And also that it wasn’t just about her life, it was also a fable about her life. Her life was strange enough, but then it was turned into a fables. And that was actually one of the debates was the finance folks wanted it put into the title that it was a fabel. I think that was in the title. Right, the long title. Yes, right. An imaginary tale or something like that. Yeah, it ended up getting a lot of cooks in the kitchen, but yeah, I had an incredible experience.

 

Kyle Buchanan One of my favorite other unique facts about Utah is that you’re something of a bar entrepreneur in Utah, which I don’t think many people can claim to be. You have four bars you’ve opened in Utah. You saw a need and you filled it.

 

Ty Burrell Yeah, well, I wish I could take credit for that. We have a wonderful third generation business person here in Utah who saw the opening when the liquor laws normalized here in 2008 or 2009. A lot of people don’t know that they ever did normalize, but they did. And it was kind of when Prohibition Era cocktail bars started up in New York and LA. And it was his idea that we, you know. Open one in Salt Lake and it really, you know, my brother and several other really smart people have made them what they are. I show up and get patted on the back for other people’s work at these bars, which, you know I’m sure drives my brother bonkers. But I really haven’t done much. I think I love them though. I think they’re really wonderful, but I can’t take credit for them. But yeah, it was. It’s an unusual thing. People still, when they hear that we’re bar owners in Utah, are still kind of confused that there are bars in Utah. I don’t know when the last time you guys were in, or if you’ve ever been to Salt Lake City, but there’s actually a pretty thriving bar scene here.

 

Louis Virtel Oh, I imagine there’s some pent-up something there waiting to be unleashed.

 

Ty Burrell Psychologically, yes, there’s room for us.

 

Louis Virtel Ty, thank you so much for being here. Always a pleasure seeing and hearing you, and I hope this project takes on other forms, some visual in the future.

 

Ty Burrell Thanks. I really appreciate it. Great chatting with you guys.

 

Louis Virtel What a pleasure. Thank you to Ty Burrell. The Good Life is available now on Audible. When we’re back, it’s keep it. And now we come to the special segment of Keep It. It’s Keep It, where we yell keep it and things that piss us off. And now Kyle is going to join our ranks and tell us what’s been bothering him recently. What’s your Keep It Kyle?

 

Kyle Buchanan So my key bit goes out to something I love, but something that could be better, which is the thing that really pisses you off when it’s like, you’re so close. And that is Survivor. In particular, Survivor 50, which just finished filming. It brings back all these legends from the previous 49 seasons of the show, but one legend did not even get a courtesy call. And I’m speaking of the goddess herself, Parvati Shallow. She was on CBS this morning, this week. And she said that nobody from the show reached out to her to see if she wanted to play again. Now, if you don’t know Parvati, this woman is a survivor legend. She was also recently on The Traders. Great on that. Also Deal or No Deal Island, if that’s the way you swing. Which some people fucking stan. There are people who ride hard for that. Yes, who knows? Maybe if I have 40 hours, I’ll give it a try. But like to not even give Parviti a courtesy call, this is like, to give an example, this is if the Oscars, when they do their 100th anniversary ceremony, they don’t even send Meryl Streak apart a full length. Like, when I tell you that Parvati’s double idol play on Heroes vs. Villains, that was an immaculate conception level event. Here’s the thing, I don’t watch that show and I remember that episode. Yes, that birthed an entire generation that was so powerful that even people who were already born were birthed by that double idol player. So, like, I didn’t get it. I do think that Jeff Probst, who host Survivor and who I do love, Like, he’s sometimes a little punitive about not having people back if they’ve gone and done other reality shows, like, Carolyn, who was on the Traders last season, also, iconically, was not asked back, or at least didn’t make the cut for Survivor 50, which is absurd. That’s such a no-brainer pick. Like, again, that’s like the Oscar saying, well, we’re not going to invite Nicole Kidman because she just did season two of Nine Perfect Strangers. Like, no, you invite Nicole Kidman just like you invite Carolyn, just like invite Parvati like At least give Parvati a courtesy call, because Ohana means family. And I learned that from Jurassic World Rebirth.

 

Louis Virtel And also, it’s just so weird that they wouldn’t invite them because it’s like, do you really want the idea that you don’t respect these people out in the world? I mean, when I think of Survivor, it’s about the legendary characters. People are not really being like, oh, that challenge where they had to throw a barrel at something was amazing. No one’s really impressed by the actual dynamics of the show. It’s the people they have on and how those people are responsible for evolving the show, turning it into this thing it totally wasn’t in season one.

 

Kyle Buchanan Parvati is a great ambassador for the show. Her beautiful face should be carved on the survivor Mount Rushmore. So at least keep her happy and make her feel like part of the family and keep the fans happy. They love Parviti. So come on, the courtesy call.

 

Louis Virtel And also, you know what? They really should have her on the Traders again. I liked her on that season, but I felt like people ended up not liking her or something. And it’s like, no, I think we need to come away from a Parvati experience feeling effervesced. And I felt, I don’t know, the tang on that season wasn’t all that.

 

Kyle Buchanan Well, the good thing is she’s sort of on this somewhat spin-offy Survivor thing. Survivor Australia, which many people swear by, is doing on Australia versus the World season. I think it’s coming out later this summer, early fall, and she’s on that. She was teasing it to me, saying that there’s a lot of great stuff on that show that she plays in a way that should excite people. So at least we have that to look forward to, if not Survivor 50.

 

Louis Virtel Very good. My keep-it is a little more distressing than this. My keep it goes to somebody I really have no problem with and in the realm of Benson Boone, I believe people should do tricks as they perform. But this does go to Jojo Siwa, who is, as I’ve said before, has hair energy, H-A-R-E. Picture like, you know, somebody on Tiny Toon Adventures like gone absolutely amuck. Like if we like only fed them with sugar-free red bulls. That’s Jojo siwa. JoJo Siwa is on my last nerve. She is allegedly considering releasing, she played a clip of this and is considering releasing it and said, should I release this? And it’s her singing Betty Davis’ Eyes. Now, let me say something. The idea that someone like JoJo siwa would even know who Betty Davis is, let alone care about. Her famous eyes that she broadcasts so brilliantly in movies like Jezebel and The Little Foxes and now Voyager. Let alone know who Kim Karns is. Right, does she? We don’t know if she knows who Kim is. I don’t now, how’d she come to this? I have no idea. She showed a clip of this. Not only does it sound bad in auto-tune, she imitates the Kim Karrns rasp. Which, by the way, is not essential to singing the song. And Kim Karnes is just a very genuinely raspy singer. Like somebody said, we wanna do Rod Stewart, but we want them to be a hot lady and can they also have been in the new Christy Minstrel’s with Kenny Rogers. And that’s how Kim Karrnes came to be. But I found Jojo Siwa’s vocal, Kim Kahn-trived, and not the genuine article. And if you’re looking for a great cover of Bette Davis’ Eyes, don’t worry, I can think of two. One… Gwyneth Paltrow does a cover of Bette Davis Eyes from what, Kyle?

 

Kyle Buchanan Duets.

 

Louis Virtel Duets!

 

Kyle Buchanan With Huey Louis.

 

Louis Virtel Right, maybe his greatest screen role.

 

Kyle Buchanan The only movie that has both Gwyneth Paltrow and Huey Louis, but maybe there should be more.

 

Louis Virtel That’s how I feel when it’s just such a sweet vocalist. Country Strong, not a great movie. Duets, a worse movie, but I love the soundtrack. And I actually prefer that version of Cruise into the Smokey Robinson version, which feels very rad to say in this era where we don’t like Smokey Robison anymore.

 

Kyle Buchanan I’m very curious to hear who your other best cover is of that song because I’ve got a dark horse. Okay.

 

Louis Virtel Covered it in about 2008. It was around that time when she was like paddling around with Cobra Starship I think so there was maybe some entertainment of a real singing career but they really like sped it up and made it a more electronified song. I just also love that song in general it’s such a weird single to like really pop off I think was the biggest single of that year in 1981 and just the lyrics sounds like like a gay man unhelpfully

 

Kyle Buchanan Well, Louis, when I tell you, I first encountered Bette Davis Eyes as a child thinking it was an Alvin and the Chipmunks original. It was on an Alvyn and the chipmunks album that my parents got me. Suffice it to say, they were not replicating the Kim Karn’s rasp. They were talking like chipmunk.

 

Louis Virtel But you know what? They slayed. You’re telling me Alvin and Simon and Theodore were like, let me tell you about Greta Garbo’s stand outside. They sure did.

 

Kyle Buchanan So, you know, if JoJo could involve some of the chipmunks, maybe I’d be willing to forgive somewhat. She also is now embracing this sort of trad wife esthetic to her vibe. It’s giving, but I’m a cheerleader. I’m not sure how I feel about it.

 

Louis Virtel No. Again, if I see her at a Pride event and she’s doing her, I’m gonna go with roundoffs, I’m having a good time. But there is something about her that I think kind of needs to be reined into artistry. And again, the fake rasp of it, it’s just not pleasing to hear. In fact, is Kim Karnes our only raspy female vocalist? I think you’re forgetting that Scarlett Johansson cut an album with Pete Yorn. Oh, and also has that Tom Waits cover album. There’s that. Right. Wow, I forgot all about her. Also, I forget about Pete Yorne. Yes, I remember 2003 and people like Ben Yellen and bands like Jet.

 

Kyle Buchanan Oh God, Jet, yeah. Do you want to be my girl?

 

Louis Virtel Yeah, are you going to be in my girl?

 

Kyle Buchanan Yes. Thank you for the semantic correction. Great. If I do it at karaoke.

 

Louis Virtel That’s right.

 

Kyle Buchanan That’s a good deep hole for karaoke.

 

Louis Virtel Uh, what do-

 

Kyle Buchanan What is your karaoke pick these days? I just did a whole bunch of karaoke for my birthday. I love Olivia Rodrigo because the songs are, you know, somewhat easy to sing. They are dramatically talk acted. So I did those, Super Rich Kids by Frank Ocean, a go-to. I did Girls by the Dare, you know that song. I don’t know why I did it except that I did.

 

Louis Virtel Very well. I like to speak sing as that is the only thing I’m capable of and mine is Night Changes by One Direction, which hits so hard in the post Liam situation. You wanna take us out on that? I don’t, I don’t I’m gonna take us here and then exit the normal ride. Kyle, thank you so much for being here for returning to Keep It where you belong if you don’t mind me saying. Anytime, Louis. We’ve pimped the hell out of the 100 Greatest Movies list but is there anything else you’d like to promote while you have these wonderful seconds left?

 

Kyle Buchanan Well, I write articles that you can find at the New York Times. I am reluctantly still on social media to the degree that people are these days. So I am on, I’m not going to call it X, Twitter, Blue Sky sometimes even, or you know, just search my name. You’ll find it.

 

Louis Virtel I have to really tap into Blue Sky, I do have an account but I always forget I have it.

 

Kyle Buchanan Yes, I think that’s most people’s blue sky experience. And there are the people who are fearsomely committed to it.

 

Louis Virtel Right, and they are lips. That is our episode. Thank you to the fabulous Ty Burrell for joining us. We will be back next week with Ira Madison. Who knows? We’ll see you then.

 

Ira Madison III Don’t forget to follow Crooked Media on Instagram, Twitter, and TikTok. You can also subscribe to Keep It on YouTube for access to full episodes and other exclusive content. And if you’re as opinionated as we are, consider dropping us a review.

 

Louis Virtel Keep It is a Crooked Media Production, our producer is Bill McGrath, our associate producer is Kennedy Hill, and our executive producers are Ira Madison III, Louis Vertel, and Kendra James.

 

Ira Madison III Our digital team is Delon Villanueva, Claudia Sheng, and Rachel Gajewski. This episode was recorded and mixed by Jarek Centeno. Thank you to David Toles, Kyle Seglin, and Charlotte Landes for production support.

 

Louis Virtel Our head of production is Matt DeGroot and our production staff is proudly unionized with the Writers Guild of America East.

 

Ira Madison III And as always, Keep It is filmed in front of a live studio audience.